InfoQube IM - Community

Submitted by David_H on 2008/12/14 10:57

I am dying to give up OneNote and fully move to IQ, and if some kind soul can help me to understand the issues I'm about to detail ready to purchase IQ.

Please agree wth and/or correct or elaborate on any of the following statements/questions.

1. Grids are not containers, they are views. Simple enough.

2. Items in IQ may have relationships to other items but they are Not defined by those relatioships, i.e. they exist on their own, independent of any other item.

3. Fields are used to save information about items. Should I look upon fields as "types" of items, or is that not a good way to look at it?

4. When I create a grid in IQ, a field is created automatically. Why? If a grid is just a view, why does a new field have to be created for every new grid?

5. Let's suppose I delete all the grids that particular items are *viewed* in. The items remain in IQ even though I no longer see them in any grids (I know I can permanently delete the items before deleting the grid if I want to). I could now set a grid just to show everything, and then find such items and permanently delete them if I know longer needed them. But would there be any other way to find them? Is there any easy way to find items which are "lonely orphans" and not shown in any grid? This is just a curiosity to help me further understand IQ. Since grids are not containers, unlike most programs like Ecco or Outlook where deleting an item deletes it everywhere, I am trying to get my head around whether there is a "place" items are stored from a *user* perspective. And if the answer is no, that's fine.

6. Here is part of my core confusion. I'm still in the middle of trying to figure out how to consistently get an item to show up in multiple grids, i.e. assign an item to multiple fields such as "inbox" and "input" and then have it show up in the grids I created with those names. And why the hecks does an item sometimes disappear from thr grid I created it in if i play with the files in another grid? For instance, I uncheck the "input" field on an item in a grid that is set to show EVERYTHING and that item disappears from the input grid. Now I recheck the input field but it doesn't show back up in the input grid? And sometimes if i play with checking a field, then i cannot uncheck it. Every time I do it flashes back to the checked state.

Comments

Exactly (same as Ecco)
Exactly (unlike in Ecco, where sub-items life was dependant on their parent)
Fields are used to save information, they are properties, attributes or whatever you want to call them. No, fields should not be viewed as types of item (unless, in your view, items can have many types, in which case, I'd say you can see it that way)
A simple convenience to the user (Ecco did the same thing). You create a grid and you can start entering info immediately into that grid
To find items, you can use Search, the Journal grid. Like I wrote in Similarities between this Web site and InfoQube..., items are stored in the database, Grids show some of these
Perhaps you can send me the file with the steps you take, but I suspect the issue is linked to the various display settings (context parents, hierarchy) and the fact that the disappearing item may be a child of some other item. You item is still in the grid, but under a closed parent (or grandparent)

This is a rough draft of something I was working on for the manual, showing relationships between items, fields and grids. Any feedback is welcome, I'm debating just how much to show on it, as it gets quite busy quickly.

I like it , Keith.

- Maybe I'd remove the red circle (to many colored lines) : the red arrow at the bottom is enough IMO.

- INstead of having two separate text boxes for the item description in the grid, I think only one with the whole description woulde be enough.

[quote]Is there any easy way to find items which are "lonely orphans" and not shown in any grid? This is just a curiosity to help me further understand IQ. Since grids are not containers, unlike most programs like Ecco or Outlook where deleting an item deletes it everywhere, I am trying to get my head around whether there is a "place" items are stored from a *user* perspective. And if the answer is no, that's fine.[/quote]

I personnally wouldn't consider an item that is not "shown" an orphan... (In fact, there are always items that are not shown, and some that you use everyday : as it is now, an item can be said to be displayed in a grid ONLY if you can actually see it. If it's under a parent, but invisible, it's not shown or filtered out in some ways : Is it then an orphan item ?

So, to answer your question on how to find lonely orphans... it all depends on your criteria of what has become useless or not. You probably have the same problem with files on your computer : how do you determine which one are now useless, and which one (will) remain useful? Not necessarily an easy task. As Pierre suggesteg, better to go by date, keyword search, etc.

That said, Pierre might be working on some other ways to clarify/strengthen (for the enduser) the item-grid relationship (one thing that would help doing is to allow to more easily show what item has been "associated" with a specific grid) . We discussed that a few weeks ago, but haven't talked about it since then. We'll see.

[quote]

I'll add my 2c here to what Pierre suggested.

Here are some things that could make your item disappear :

- You move an item to another grid without pressing CTRL. That could remove the item's source correspondance with the previous grid.

- Full Hierarchy is not on (Grid->Hierarchy--> Full Hierarchy). This is the first one I'd look at.

(Note for PIERRE : I said it already... I really think that there should be no other option than full hierarchy. This is confusing and really really not easily understood. )

- One of your filters is preventing your item to show up. (Filter criteria applies to subitem, source, date filter, Alpha numeric filter etc. : check these out!)

- You switched from Hierarchy ON to hierarchy OFF, and now you only see parents.

But if you could recreate an example with a default grid, that would help us to help.

not wanting to confuse things but I think the screenshot looks good the way it is - maybe if we could get a comment from someone who doesnt know this info...

I do, & I think the screenshot looks really good - but maybe I'm just being seduced by all those lovely curves ...

(I do think it's clear enough too though - again, a subjective opinion)

About keith's screenshot : what I "don't like" about the red circle is that it distracts my eyes from the arrows and I don't find that helps me to focus on the grid. It has nothing (or not mucht) to do with me knowing (or not knowing) IQ. Same thing for the text boxes at the bottom. But, of course... as you said Tom, that's subjective.

Thanks for the feedback. I've got an improved version, with a square rather than the circle, and 2 text boxes; it's not as distracting. I'll post it to the manual in a day or two.

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it looks even better now Keith - you could make a career in layout/design (maybe you have already lol)

On this, I agree with Tom. I think the mark up looks awesome. As for people who understand IQ or are programmatically advanced, minimizing lines may be useful. However, for the uninitiated, it is important to indicate the"obvious".

I especially think this is the case since "item" is one of the fields being highlighted and, from the forum, people seem to have a hard time understanding the relationship between grids, items, fields, properties, etc. For example, I can easily, easily see someone asking the questions: Where are the field "Manufacturer" and "Model"? Why are they no shown and where did they go? Why are are they not shown in the properties?

[quote=David_H]6. Here is part of my core confusion. I'm still in the middle of trying to figure out how to consistently get an item to show up in multiple grids, i.e. assign an item to multiple fields such as "inbox" and "input" and then have it show up in the grids I created with those names. And why the hecks does an item sometimes disappear from thr grid I created it in if i play with the files in another grid? For instance, I uncheck the "input" field on an item in a grid that is set to show EVERYTHING and that item disappears from the input grid. Now I recheck the input field but it doesn't show back up in the input grid? And sometimes if i play with checking a field, then i cannot uncheck it. Every time I do it flashes back to the checked state.
[/quote]

More testing has me thinking part of my confusion may be some bugs that I am experiencing, and perhaps in a few instances some setting that is wrong. Overall my views are pretty much working now, with some exceptions I hope Pierre can help me clear up. Pierre, you have mail.